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How easily we forget the message of the Playa. I am a single father bringing up two children and if I could move to SF to work for this Organization I would do so without any hesitation and for a drastic pay cut, because if you are really experiencing what Burning Man is trying to present, money, career, material possession do not and should not even come into your mind and there is the problem, our mind the thing that built the ego and the thing which Burning Man is allowing us to see, ego vs self.
One day I will work for this organization and will help it to spread the message which is the message to humanity at large. What is wrong with that because the alternative is what we have created, wake up world, we are here at the crossroads are we going to go the same way as our ancestors went, leaving traces of clues but no book to decode what happened or are we going to evolve. This just in…the NFL is not a c 3. First, until they change and the ticket revenues are paid directly to the non-profit and become tax-deductible , the LLC can do with them whatever they want.
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That includes bonuses and salaries. That is, the non-profit owner cannot tell the LLC what to do.
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It is not like owning shares in a corporation, where the majority of shares can control the company. It is an LLC, which is designed to have passive members who are not involved in the day-to-day operations. The LLC can sell ownership to the non-profit, where the non-profit owes money to the previous LLC owners, or whatever debt obligations they loaded up before the transfer such as deferred compensation to the previous LLC owners.
That money would be paid at a later date, with or without interest. This is the way a building owner sells a building to a co-op; though the co-op owns the building. The co-op still owes a lot of money to the previous owner, in addition to the initial purchase price, because the previous owner loaded up the building with debt before he sold it — a sale that included the debt obligations.
Of course the debt obligations can be to third parties, but the money finds its way back to the seller.
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And like the LLC, Bose gave that stock as non-voting shares that cannot be sold. MIT gets any distributed share profits from Bose, but has no control over Bose operations. But unlike a co-op or LLC sale, as a publicly-traded C-corporation, everything is disclosed. So, if you want to volunteer your time to a for-profit for the benefit of a non-profit, you can go wash the cars in the Bose parking lot in Framingham, or hold a bake sale for Bose, or promote Bose speakers to your friends.
Because any benefit from all that will be disclosed in the Bose financials, and you can actually see how much money MIT gets. That is not a concern if your shares cannot be sold, and particularly if the board of the for-profit, and the non-profit that owns them, are essentially the same people.
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And hopefully Tanya Everywhere is on the right track. Nomad…Sigh…so I have to ask you what I never understood from Tanya…why do you care? The org could have sold the event to the execs at Google and retired on their own island. They could have licensed the trademarks they own for many millions. All evidence shows they have managed the event, which they founded, and which was theirs to exploit in any way they chose, for the benefit of the community.
Have you met the founders? They are lovely attractive people, but do they strike you as the penthouse, day spa type? Where is the suspicion comming from? If you could see the full financials, what could you see that would suggest to you the org has played dirty with the running of the event? Pooh Bear, I care because I went to the Burn five times and invested many man-months in creating my contribution to the stone soup event.
They are profiting from the work hundreds of thousands of Burners have done and millions of dollars spent to make it happen. If they were up-front with all this, as they could by disclosing all the financials, it would be one thing. That way we could all make our informed decisions to contribute, or not. But we are being sold smoke and mirrors, and being asked to pay no attention to the man behind the curtain and what profits he might be making. The apparent attempt is to preserve the ever-growing spin and denial of the facts to keep the contributions of time, effort and money coming in.
For the stone soup to continue, the theme camps and artists have to keep coming. The solution is simple: disclose all the financials. There is no good reason not to, unless that would disillusion the cult followers. Sorry to be the Toto that pulls the curtain. When you worked on those projects, did you do it expecting to be paid? Do you not understand the idea of gifting? Burning Man has always said volunteering your time and effort is part of the event.
The org never said no-one made a profit. So for the th time, what would it matter if the Financials showed Larry made a billion dollars a year if the event is what the event is? The devil is in the details. Seem like a lot of un-substantiated accusations and innuendo. Keep in mind non-profits are formed and governed by states a non-profit in one state will have different obligation than another state.
I am not an expert but my understanding is in California One very critical restriction is that the assets of a public benefit corporation must be irrevocably dedicated to charitable purposes, and cannot be distributed for private gain. By loading up debt obligation and then collection on that debt would be a form of private gain and would be illegal. But if the for profit-LLC sold it assets e. Co-ops are not non-profit, but are incorporated under state co-op statues which recognize co-op as businesses that exist to serve their members.
IRS regulations require charities to make these records available for inspection by any person. Also statutory members have legal rights to receive annual reports, to inspect and copy corporation records. Live where you fear to live. Destroy your reputation. Be notorious.
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The BM Project is the non-profit c 3 curtain. Simple: show the balance sheet for the sale of the LLC to the c 3. Even when the c 3 might start selling tickets, it may have to pay off the debt associated with the asset. As for fair-market value, the Burn has a proven revenue stream. That means that it has an asset value greater than any real property. If we saw the sales documents to the c 3 , we could see what the valuation was. If they did it like building owners do when they sell to a co-op, they know the fair market value of the building, which includes future income.
To avoid taxes, the sale is usually an installment sale, so the seller is not hit with a large capital gain in one year at a high tax rate. If they were above board in all this, that would be great. But they are not. Instead, they are flying the non-profit flag, and having it both ways. Please, please, please tell us what you think the org could be doing that would indicate they are profiting unreasonably considering it is their event, or was until the c 3 went into effect, I cannot fathom what unreasonable would be or is behaving in some nefarious way.
So I just got back from therapy. It went great, just what I needed. Then the therapist had the nerve to tell me I had to pay him for the session. I totally participated in that session. I talked way more than he did. Is he making some kind of profit off of my participation? He should show me his bank statements immediately. I just know I have. So, of course I have a mass quantity to go thru each year. Help a brother out. Decommodification LLC will ensure that the funding from licensing of the marks will never touch the c 3 it will also ensure a steady revenue stream for the former share holders.
Gerlach Holdings LLC will apparently oversee the property that is purchased in the area around the playa and will also serve as a revenue stream for the former share holders each entity has nothing to do with BRC LLC or the c 3. If the former shareholders would just admit what they make and stop trying to appease the detractors I would have less of an issue.
I could care less what they make personally but as the daughter of an artist who watched her parent struggle to make ends meet on art I have issues with what I perceive to be exploitation or artists. If the event showed that Larry Harvey made a billion dollars a year off the event the org might have a harder time getting people to volunteer their time, funding and resources. The world is going towards openness, the language of We, not proprietary monopolies, the language of Robber Barons.
They have a right to make money, sure, good on them — as Tanya says, meanwhile the artists are starving — the majority get NOTHING from BMOrg, and even the top ones only get a small honorarium, not really enough even for their logistics costs. Make money, be honest with the community, reach the ladder down to those who are still struggling. Burners calling for this are not being greedy, and not denying the founders their right to profit from their quarter century.
I might know more than the average person about corporate structure and business it might be because I worked in an industry based around it for years. Perhaps I found something that seemingly gave more meaning to life than the pursuit of the all mighty dollar. Maybe I was happy to no longer be the dark sheep of the flock instead finding a flock of all colors.
I could possibly have been happy and in turn took my time my money and my know how to help keep it going forward without asking for anything in return. This could have happened, quote possibly it did but just as I was able to see the problems with my prior profession I too can see issues here. Just as I questioned the issues in my other industry I too question issues here. How does one preserve a culture whose core has gone rotten? The Burning Man Project will most certainly release this information. In fact, as has been pointed out elsewhere, it is required to do so by law.
We will not do this now, but wait until later this year when the transition is complete. When that time arrives, however, a bright shining light will illuminate what we have done in thorough detail. In the meantime, I suggest that he is not quite like Toto, who pulls the curtain away from the fraudulent wizard, but more like less precocious canines who bark in the dark.
It seems you never really left the corporate entity you used to belong to. You are obsessed with money. You clearly live in a world of suspicion that cannot be cracked by integrity, ideology, or evidence. Cynicism is not cool. It makes you the Darrell Issa of the playa, desperately searching for a scandal to justify your existence. You seem to find something suspicious in Decommodification LLC.
You assume that is an entity to exploit Intelectual property instead of protect it from commercial exploitation, which the org has always done. Which again, they have always had the right to do and refrained from doing. All the evidence is the org has behaved responsibly in protecting and growing the event and the culture. Not that I want to shut you up. Hell this is pretty entertaining and probably makes the point better than the announcement alone could do. You have a perfect right to express your suspicions, even if they are based on nothing. You may try to minimize my impact by maligning my intentions and claiming my points are simply bottom line oriented.
In fact I no longer work for a large corporate entity however I retain the knowledge of large corporations, structured and layered entity placement and fund flow. I ask these questions not as a lay person and quite frankly your accusations are hilarious. Oh you must be in it for the money and big corporate because you look at it from a business perspective. I have worked with numerous non-profits including art based ones and assisted many artists in their operations in achieving a place in which they can earn a living on their art and not starve or go broke or sell out.
In addition I have worked with local government branches and politicians to work for affordable housing in a major city. I am saying I have no idea what is being done behind the scenes because there is no transparency and given that these organizations will continue to exist as privately held corporations which have no reporting requirement it is wholly on the the entity owners to create or assist in transparency. Tanya … oh stop with the false outrage. And I never said you were in it for the money, I said you are obsessed with money. Your obsession has lead you to create some injustice in your mind that the org must be guilty of, even though you have no evidence of it.
Money is a tool. Not everything is about money. It makes you a better person and frees you from being a product or seeing others as exploitable. It is in the process of becoming a non-profit now, with all the public controls which you should be familiar with that come with that. The Spark movie was in line with the goals of the Black Rock City foundation did I get that name right because it promoted the themes of Burning Man to the wider public. If the org could do that AND get paid for it, good on them. Is there something wrong with using Burning Man intellectual property to promote the values of the culture?
Are you Pooh Bear? If there was transparency one could make a fully formed decision. My involvement with the event itself extends beyond just buying a ticket and showing up demanding services. My involvement extended to personal financial loss and labor because I honestly wanted to believe that what was going on was something that I could feel supportive of to that level. Tanya…I have all the evidence I need to hold my position.
I am supporting my position on this thread with that evidence which you completely ignore. What is public is all the evidence anyone should need that the founders are running the event with integrity. You have never responded to the obvious fact that the founders could have profited greatly by licensing the Burning Man IP and only have in the few situations where it promoted the culture without commercializing it.
Even if the founders could pay participants which is a ridiculous notion just given the budgeting that is public , I as a Burner would be really, really pissed if they did. That would completely change the nature of the event. I live in a small town. I am an actor. I have been doing that for 40 years. There was a great theater in town all the local actors loved to work at because the artistic director was a genius. The problem was, this is a small town.
There was no way for the theater to make enough money to pay actors. That was not a problem for the actors. We never expected to be paid. Then someone on the board decided the artistic director was a poor business man. So they fired this brilliant artistic director.
The theater has struggled ever since. The community lost a great cultural asset and us actors lost a great place to play. No one is forced to volunteer or participate at Burning Man. The org provides the infrastructure, the community provides the culture. Burning man could exist if no one gave anything, it would just be really boring and pointless. Really Tanya, we understand the way this works. There are lots of places in the world that need your zeal for justice, please apply them there.